Understanding and Improving Shampoo and SOAP via Kullback-Leibler Minimization
Bibliographic record
Abstract
Shampoo and its efficient variant, SOAP, employ structured second-moment estimations and have shown strong performance for training neural networks (NNs). In practice, however, Shampoo typically requires step-size grafting with Adam to be competitive, and SOAP mitigates this by applying Adam in Shampoo's eigenbasis -- at the cost of additional memory overhead from Adam in both methods. Prior analyses have largely relied on the Frobenius norm to motivate these estimation schemes. We instead recast their estimation procedures as covariance estimation under Kullback-Leibler (KL) divergence minimization, revealing a previously overlooked theoretical limitation and motivating principled redesigns. Building on this perspective, we develop $\textbf{KL-Shampoo}$ and $\textbf{KL-SOAP}$, practical schemes that match or exceed the performance of Shampoo and SOAP in NN pre-training while achieving SOAP-level per-iteration runtime. Notably, KL-Shampoo does not rely on Adam to attain competitive performance, eliminating the memory overhead introduced by Adam. Across our experiments, KL-Shampoo consistently outperforms SOAP, Shampoo, and even KL-SOAP, establishing the KL-based approach as a promising foundation for designing structured methods in NN optimization. An implementation of KL-Shampoo/KL-SOAP is available at https://github.com/yorkerlin/KL-Methods
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How this classification was reachedexpand
Full frame distilled prediction
Teacher imitationNot calibrated prevalence, not ground truth. Human validation pending. Learned from the 10,348 direct Codex labels and 10,348 direct Gemma labels. Candidate is the union of thresholded teacher heads; consensus is their intersection. These outputs are machine_predicted_unvalidated and are not human labels or direct frontier model labels.
Codex and Gemma teacher scores by category
| Category | Codex | Gemma |
|---|---|---|
| Metaresearch | 0.000 | 0.000 |
| Meta-epidemiology (narrow) | 0.000 | 0.000 |
| Meta-epidemiology (broad) | 0.000 | 0.000 |
| Bibliometrics | 0.000 | 0.000 |
| Science and technology studies | 0.000 | 0.000 |
| Scholarly communication | 0.000 | 0.000 |
| Open science | 0.000 | 0.002 |
| Research integrity | 0.000 | 0.000 |
| Insufficient payload (model declined to judge) | 0.000 | 0.000 |
Machine scores (provisional)
The two teacher heads of the student model, read on this work. A score orders the frame for review; it never asserts a category, and the validation status ships verbatim with every row.
Baseline scores from an immature model (maturity gate not passed, 7 training rounds). Scores rank; they never assert a category.
score_only:v0-immature-baseline · verbatim from the scoring run: score_only means the number may rank works, and no category label ships from itClassification
machine, unvalidatedMachine predicted; a candidate call from one teacher head, not a consensus.
How this classification was reached, model by model and score by score, is at the end of the page under "How this classification was reached".